Suzi is broken and needs an errata

Card draw simulator

Odds: 0% – 0% – 0% more
Derived from
None. Self-made deck here.
Inspiration for
None yet

Oghma · 1

Disclosure: At time of writing I am 48 hours awake and well into levels of madness. My interpretation of rules may be and likely are wrong so take this write up with a grain of salt and provide feedback on where I went wrong in my reading of the rules. Also pay no attention to the deck list as its just quickly put together to be publishable

A couple of rules and faq answers that we'll be referring to later.

Diana FAQ

These cards are **considered** out of play. They cannot be affected by anything other than the abilities that refer to them explicitly (like Sefina's action ability, Twilight Blade, etc). 

"As if..."

Some card effects allow an investigator to resolve an ability or perform an action as if a certain aspect of the game state were altered, using the text "as if..." to indicate the difference. The indicated ability or action is resolved with the altered game state in mind, but the actual game state remains unchanged.

The game state is considered to be altered throughout the duration of the indicated ability or action, from its initiation (including the paying of its costs, attacks of opportunity, etc) through the resolution of each aspect of its effect, and up until its completion.

Other card abilities or game effects resolved during this duration are also resolved with the altered game state in mind.

**The game state is not physically altered in any way**. (e.g. if you are considered to be at a location, you do not move your mini-card to that location, enemies at that location do not automatically move to your threat area, etc.)

Ability:

An ability is the specialized game text that indicates how a card affects the game.

**Card abilities only interact with the game if the card bearing the ability is in play,** unless the ability (or rules for the cardtype) specifically references its use from an out-of-play area.

**Card abilities only interact with other cards that are in play, unless the ability specifically references an interaction with cards in an out-of-play area.**
If multiple instances of the same ability are in play, each instance interacts with (or may interact with) the game state individually.

In Play and Out of Play

The cards that a player controls in his or her play area are considered in play.

The current act, the current agenda, each location in the play area, and each encounter card in a investigator's threat area or at a location, are all considered in play.

Out of play refers to the cards in a player's hand, in any deck, in any discard pile, in the victory display, and those that have been set aside and/or removed from the game.

A card enters play when it transitions from an out-of-play origin to an in play area.
**A card leaves play when it transitions from a in play area to an out-of-play destination.**
Tokens on in play cards are considered in play. Resources in each investigator's resource pool are also considered in play.

Location Cards

Location cards represent the places the investigators may explore during a scenario.

Use each investigator's mini-card to indicate which location he or she is at.
While an investigator is at a location, that investigator, each of his or her assets, and each card in that investigator's threat area is at the same location.

Being at No Location (added in FAQ, section 'Game Play', point 1.21)

Unless explicitly specified by game text, enemies and investigators must always be at a location during gameplay. If an effect (such as a "cannot move" effect) would cause an investigator or enemy to not be at a location, ignore that effect.

Move

Any time an entity (an investigator or enemy) moves, transfer that enemy card or investigator's mini card from its current location to a different location.

Permanent

Permanent is a deckbuilding keyword ability.

A card with the permanent keyword does not count towards your deck size.

A card with the permanent keyword still counts as being part of your deck and must therefore adhere to all other deckbuilding restrictions.

**A card with the permanent keyword starts each game in play** and is not shuffled into your investigator deck during setup.

 A card with the permanent keyword cannot leave play (except by elimination).

Once added to your deck, permanent cards cannot be removed from your deck or swapped out of your deck unless explicitly stated otherwise.

Appendix III: Setting Up The Game

To setup a game, perform the following steps in order:

Choose investigators. Each player chooses a different investigator, and places that **investigator's card in his or her play area**.

Triggered Abilities

 An investigator is permitted to use triggered abilities (, , and abilities) from the following sources:

A card in play and under his or her control. **This includes his or her investigator card.**

Still with me? Good! Now that we have the relevant rules out of the way let's talk jank.

Part 1: Permanent All 6's Suzi

Once something is in play, it remains in play until moved to an out of play space. Permanents cannot leave play and face down cards under (at least Diana/Sefina) are only considered out of play but not actually out of play. Effectively if you eat an permanent or other cad that can't leave play, when Ravenous Hunger flips any permanent is now stuck to ravenous hunger and cant be removed thus providing a permanent stat boost (and permanent uncontrolled hunger). If you can get a good regurgitate, or several, you can slowly build up 5 permanents under the hunger bar for all 6's

Part 2: Invincible Investigators

Investigator cards are considered in play as per Appendix 3 and are under the control of the owner and therefore are valid targets for devouring. Once they have been devoured all sorts of shenanigans can begin.

First: Monster cards and treachery cannot interact with the player card as it is considered out of play (see abilities)

Second: Each investigator, while out of play, is still in a location and is free to move and investigate as that has no requirement to be in play.

Third: Investigator triggered abilities cannot activate due to not being in play.

6 comments

Jul 28, 2023 Snilly · 1

Suzi is a silly PnP investigator. Surely you can understand that maybe this works RAW, but there's no rules clarification on her and that this is not RAI which is imo a good enough reason to not do this/bring this to the table.

Jul 28, 2023 Oghma · 1

@Snilly this definitely is more intended as a poking at the rules in weird ways, than an actual build idea. Its like showing up to a 3.5 session with punpun, completely kills the fun.

Jul 28, 2023 chirubime · 25504

I'm not sure I'm following, how do you take non-sig permanents in Suzi?

Jul 28, 2023 Oghma · 1

@chirubime you don't. You eat your allies no longer useful permanents such as another day another dollar

Jul 29, 2023 chirubime · 25504

Yeah, definitely the ravings of madness. You meant devouring other investigator's permanents/investigator cards in multiplayer. I see. She's taken on face value the way you would a Barkham investigator I imagine. There's a lot of issues with her for sure. It just feels worse that it feels like they half-assed attempts to futureproof/keep her within the confines of the rules by saying she can't take permanents, but then she can eat permanents another investigator takes.

Aug 24, 2023 Ektheleon · 198

Since the rules they released with her didn't explicitly clear this up, sent a question into the rules form:

"Can Suzi devour permanents? Can Suzi devour investigator cards? Can Suzi devour investigator mini-cards?"

Response:

"To answer your question(s):

No, Suzi can’t devour permanents, investigator cards, or investigator mini-cards."